India's Dalits seek economic equality
Some Indians are hoping a politician named Mayawati will be elected their prime minister. As a Dalit -- the lowest of Indian castes -- her rise may give others hope. But most people of that social level are still struggling. Rico Gagliano reports.
In this neighborhood of Mumbai, India, poor families live crammed into into tiny one-room apartments. Students who can't concentrate on their work in these crowded homes go to this quiet road behind a hospital where they study under the green glow of streetlights, or around small campfires. (Rico Gagliano / Marketplace)
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Kai Ryssdal: India's month-long national election begins tomorrow. And all eyes will be on a politician named Mayawati. She's making moves to become the country's next prime minister. Which is a big deal because she's a Dalit. That's what people in the lowest Hindu social castes call themselves; they used to be called "untouchables." Mayawati's rise is a hopeful sign for Dalits. But as Marketplace's Rico Gagliano reports, most people of that social level still find themselves struggling for economic equality.
AMOL KAMBLE: Hello, this is Amol Kamble, from India.
RICO GAGLIANO: Racially, Amol Kamble is no different than any Indian. But socially, his Hindu surname pegs him as a Dalit. I first meet him in Mumbai one night in a jail.
Well, it was a jail, back in colonial days. Now it's one of many crowded apartment buildings in this chawl -- a neighborhood just a cut above a slum. Amol's whole family -- six people -- live in one 18-by-20-foot room. They share one bathroom with everyone else on their floor. A few years ago, when Amol attended public college, he found the building just too loud for studying. So he went to a better place. We head there by taxi.
GAGLIANO: So where are we going now?
KAMBLE: Study Street. What we call Study Street.
GAGLIANO: Study Street? So everybody in this neighborhood would go to study in this place?
KAMBLE: Yeah, under the streetlight.
GAGLIANO: Under the streetlight?
KAMBLE: Yeah.
Amol points out the window, and there they are: Dozens of people on the sidewalk, reading textbooks under streetlights. Some have built little campfires.
This Dalit student says he wishes the local government would install some seats. And leave the streetlights on later, so he could study longer.
Still, many of these people consider themselves lucky. In some rural areas, Dalit people are considered "impure" -- so low on the social ladder they're not even supposed to touch the Indian flag. Here in progressive Mumbai, if they get a degree, they could get a decent job. But some say a degree alone won't get Amol out of this chawl. Because even in cities, the remains of the caste system linger.
CHANDRABHAN PRASAD: I feel it is more a psychological problem than social.
Chandrabhan Prasad is a columnist for India's newspaper "The Pioneer." He's also a Dalit. He says, legally, caste discrimination is banned, but that many in the upper castes still can't bring themselves to give Dalit workers promotions, or sometimes hire them at all. He tells me about a 2007 study from a Dalit group and Princeton sociologists. They sent identical fake resumes, under different fake surnames, to Indian companies.
PRASAD: And often the resume with the same qualification, with the Dalit-sounding surname, it was rejected.
In some industries, like tech, that's changing. But the one employer Dalits know won't balk at their resumes is the government. For decades, it's had an affirmative-action program. Some state and federal jobs get set aside for lower castes. They call this "reservation." Amol Kamble's dad worked a reservation job. That's how he could afford to send Amol to school. Prasad says the program has helped.
PRASAD: Federal or state jobs have created a Dalit middle class. But that is not enough.
It's not enough because, thanks to privatization, the government is shrinking, and with it the number of reservation jobs. Prasad says what's needed now is reservation at private companies. The government says it sympathizes, that there's a committee considering the idea and that they're funding training programs to help Dalits crack the private sector.
Sanjay Kumar is with the Ministry of Justice and Empowerment.
SANJAY KUMAR: Infosys, in partnership with the government, trained 86 students. And I'm glad to tell you that 74 of them have found as good jobs as anyone else in very reputed software companies.
Since this interview, around 500 more graduated that program. But there are an estimated 160 million Dalits in India. Meanwhile, a federal bill mandating private reservations is hung up in Parliament. So one Dalit has started his own affirmative-action plan.
MICHAEL THEVAR: Hi, this is Michael Thevar. We are at the Philadelphia International Airport. We are waiting for some Dalit friends of ours coming from India.
Michael Thevar is a Dalit himself. After years of work, and with the help of a non-Dalit Christian surname -- his father converted -- he came to the U.S. on an exchange program for social workers. Now he owns two health-care staffing companies here. And every year since 2001 he's flown in Dalits from India and given them full-time jobs.
THEVAR: They are masters-level, social-work professionals and masters-level clinicians. And they are from the slums, rural and tribal areas of India.
Thevar says this is the only program of its kind. Most Indians in America are from middle or upper castes; Dalits are rarely able to migrate here. So when the new workers arrive, they're dazed at their luck. This is the first time social worker Neetu Bhole has ever flown in a plane.
NEETU BHOLE: It was . . . I can say it was amazing. It was like my own dream which is coming true. Even I was not able to believe that, yeah, it's . . . everything is happening.
Amol Kamble, from Study Street, was supposed to be one of Neetu's co-workers. Thevar recruited him more than a year ago. But there's a lottery for America's 85,000 skilled-worker visas, and Amol lost. He's still back in the chawl.
I'm Rico Gagliano for Marketplace.
Comments
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From delhi, 07/03/2009
this caste menace has been there from centuries and would remain there for almost 500 years more if Indians dont change their mentality even after being educated. it has crossed even religion lines too.
I am a dalit too and live in the capital delhi. And i have faced discrimination right from my child hood not only from hindus but also from muslims as i live in muslim dominated area neighbourhood.
Its pity but the truth
Educated indians first have to shed their castes and accept the reality in order to bring some change.
here we find castes in even english newspapers read by 2% of highly educated indians
forget about hindi ones
even one matrimonial sites there are caste columns before the profession column.
being in delhi city if i can face such discrimination I cant imagine about my relatives living in rural areas of the country.
Also no. of pop of villages is over 85 % here.
http://reservationfacts.blogspot.com
this link show horrible videos of indian caste system
and it is pity that indian media [like India TV] telecaste youtube videos like monkey fighting with a snake almost everyday but despite having their own reporting mechanism, they havent even by mistake telecast hard reality of india which would displease the most of the hindus who are influential and are their major consumers of their services because SC/STs remain in villages where there are no TV sets, even no electricity at all.
From London, NE, 06/25/2009
I would like to contact the producers /authors of this piece to find out the location of Study Street. I am going to visit Mumbai, and thought that I could take with me some hand-wound LED torches. This seems like a very low-tech way of making a big difference to the lives of these Dalits. Does anyone have any information on how I could locate 'Study Street'? Thanks in advance.
04/22/2009
This refers to comments by Shubhanan B and Leena Patel which represent purely brahmanical mind set of prejudice and fake superiority. Their views not only show their dominating (ill)attitude but are very inhuman in nature. Think of a community who have tasted fruits of undefined reservations for centuries and now they are crying about merit. Which is of course not anybody's prerogative. Are these mindsets clear about the various scams/frauds done by so-called upper caste people? Are they aware that mostly upper-caste Gujaratis kill their girl child before here birth? Have these people witnessed how much dowry is offered for marriage? As far as capable medicos are concerned can these people furnish the data as how many people died or mistreated after taking medical treatment from reservation group? Wake up my friends ! gone are the days when one group was considered most efficient and others slaves. Give everybody an equal chance to prove his/her merit. Do you think anybody in India done far more service than Dr. Babasaheb Ambedkar? If still in confusion read his books like - 'Annihilation of caste' and his speech while dedicating Constitution to the nation. I can provide you if you don't have it.
From HI, 04/19/2009
"
I had spent many nights in bed hungry because the last of the food went to my little sister.
"
I like this part from Darrell's blog. Contrast Darrell's attitude with Orwell's 1984. As I remember 1984, when Winston was growing up he would beg his mother to give the last bit of chocolate to him and not to his little sister. I vaguely remember that the sister died, according to the narrative. It also reminds me of *Around the World in 80 Days" which included a story about Hindu Brahman who with help from an Englishman escaped her assisted suicide during dead husband's funeral.
What horrible attitude some humans have towards their own mothers and sisters. How lame to kill ones own child simply because she is female! Can we expect anything better from cultures in which such evil festers for generations? Can we expect anything but hereditary caste system from them?
How you can explain a culture which honors the beauty of non-existence, nirvana; yet constantly overpopulates to the extent that farmers end life with suicide for lack of sufficient land to earn living. Have we lost the knack of using simple logic. What has become of us? What has become of our leaders? Which one am I talking?
You got it
!
From New York, NY, 04/16/2009
Great work! Kai Ryssdal please write more about Dalits. Its time to open eyes wide shut and face stark reality that behind the Shining India lays millions of languishing dalits.
The usual hue and cry by the upper castes about no caste discrimination and unjust reservation is least surprising especially when any foreign media takes due notice of dalits plight. However, it is pertinent to reply comments that try to distort fact from fiction primarily when it comes to caste discrimination and reservation policy.
Majority of upper caste people deliberately ignore the prevailing caste discrimination by giving reference to vague socio-economic development of educated dalits. One needs to enlighten them about how many dalit entrepreneurs they have known? How many dalit sports person are encouraged? Why does the Supreme Court of India fail to appoint dalit judges on its bench? Why does the media fail to report atrocities committed against dalits? Well the answer to these questions and many others related to the dalit discrimination whether practiced explicitly or implicitly pre dominantly lies in the castiest mindset of the Hindus. No matter which part of the world the Hindus live the caste gutter that flows from their mentality pollutes the basic democratic values of equality, liberty and fraternity.
About Reservations, it has not brought any sea change among the dalits soc-economic lifestyle however it succeed in creating the ripples that in itself has shaken if not destroyed the Brahminical hierarchy. Maintaining the present reservation and furthering it in private sector would certainly benefit the dalits and the country as whole.
(Nobel Laureate Prof. Amartya Sen backing Reservation policy stated, “"You have to see what best you can do to meet the demands for justice and efficiency in the delivery of public services," he said, adding that affirmative action was prevalent in many societies. Harvard had a policy of giving extra credits to those from a disadvantaged school, other criteria being equal. Merit should not be discerned from the performance in an institution, but from a person's efficiency over a period of time. Dealing with it figuratively, the eminent economist quoted Mark Twain to contend that a navigator's efficiency should not be judged from the 'next bend in the river' but from his knowledge of the 'whole shape of the river'. Sen advocated an approach to problems based on 'nyaya', rather than 'neethi', distinguishing the two terms for justice by describing the latter as a mere set of rules and the former as the fair outcome and realization of the benefits of law.)
http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/articleshow/3870788.cms
Importantly, I would urge that a study research should be conducted to find out how many of those meritorious students belonging to upper caste stayed back to serve their country after the Government spending on their higher education. It would not come as a surprise that most of those students left abroad for personal aggrandizement. Particularly, speaking about merit one need to retrospect the progress made by India which has predominately been governed by the Upper caste Hindus. Statistically speaking India’s performance on Human Development Index, Human Poverty Index; General Empowerment Measure; Gender Development Index; General National Product; Education Index and several other indicators like Adult Literacy and Life Expectancy etc., is dismally low. Check 2007/2008 Human Development Report:
http://hdrstats.undp.org/countries/country_fact_sheets/cty_fs_IND.html
Development of India lies in giving millions of dalits equal opportunity to participate and not in marginalizing them from social, economic and political stream.
Today the people whom Mr. Michael Thevar gave an opportunity to work in US, never ever thought about being in US, who rather have taken generations to come over to US, now have become financially sound and are planning to settle here to give equal opportunity in casteless environment to their children. I wish them success and hope they will support their dalit bothers and sisters way back at home India. The steps taken by Mr. Michael Thevar towards affirmative action by employing people from marginalized communities is commendable. I believe his efforts need to be recognized and appreciated by the Government of India and every such organization that believes in equality.
About Mayavatiji, it has become the trend to criticize her governance simply because she belongs to lower caste. What she has achieved by bringing together the upper caste and lower caste votes perhaps any other politician can ever achieve which in fact needs to be appreciated. People overlook such social engineering strategy and criticize Mayavatiji’s governance however; these same people keep silent on politics of terror as seen in Gujarat and other parts of country just because the perpetrator propagates their vested religious interest.
Finally, you can find thousands of upper caste Hindu youths to join political propaganda, address issues (“pink chaddi”) and such others but you cannot get one single youth to take up the cause of atrocities committed against dalits. These upper caste youths can light candle on death of a upper caste girl at a night bar and raise a hue and cry to bring the perpetrators to justice but fail to raise voice on dalit girl paraded naked and raped in broad day light. Democracy and democratic life, justice and conscience, which are sustained by a belief in democratic principle, are foreign to the Hindu mind.
Rahul Gade. LL.M.,
New York,USA
From Berkeley, CA, 04/16/2009
I find Darrel Parker's story compelling but disturbing in some of the things he underhandedly implies. "So I didn’t complain, whine, steal from my neighbors or sell drugs to get by. My mom didn’t sell herself on the streets to maintain a drug habit." The generalization is clear, and even though he complains of the effects of "reverse discrimination," he himself has not worked out his own racist feelings. The long comment is simmering with racist resentment towards minorities and portrays him a victim of affirmative action and other such programs intended to help minorities. What even more disturbing is that Darrel, due to his circumstances in life, has blinded himself to the experiences of others and has conflated two different issues: citizens who happen to be minorities and minorities who are coming into this country and are getting the jobs. The remark he makes about selling oneself as a prostitute, stealing and selling drugs is clearly an underhand reference to aspects of the African-American community, and moreover, it's a ill-intended generalizations because it spares nobody. Darrel perhaps due to his education or lack thereof in certain areas, did not learn sufficiently about the history of this country and the evils of slavery and the plight of African Americans to be able to have a balanced judgment and understand the necessity of having programs which give people their only chance of forging ahead. So, the main point is that Darrel is generalizing from bitter experience and does not demonstrate historical and sociological understanding of the condition of people of color due to the hegemony of whites and its various forms of systemic racism. Darrel needs to flesh out his experience a little more because his resentment does not allow him to draw the right conclusion from all of it. Plus, appealing to pity is not the best way to go about making an argument. Millions of people are undergoing what you described or worse.
From North Wales, PA, 04/16/2009
What this man michael thevar is doing is what no other man in the world is doing he is the first person to help the lower caste in india. I am a dalit and i am proud to be one i live in a casteless society and want to help others like mr thevar has been doing. it is people like him who makes this world a better place to live in. He has inspired me to help fight against the caste system. Dalits have been facing the social ramifications of discriminations in india and know michel thevar is going to break that barrier and bring in equality so if michael thevar will read this he will realize that he has one more person to fight for this cause.
From Pittsburgh, PA, 04/16/2009
Thanks for the brief but enlightening coverage of the Dalit situation. I had only heard of the problem superficially. Now I think I have a better grasp of the situation, and I am appropriately appalled.
From Kalyan, IN, 04/16/2009
There is no question of seeking economic equality. Economic equality is also fundamental right guaranteed to all its citizens under the Indian Constitution. The ruling parties at the Centre for the last over 60 years did not bother to implement the constitutional provisions and to include the tribal and dalit christians and hill tribes into the mainstream Indian City Society.
From Citrus Heights, CA, 04/16/2009
Mr. Gagliano, your article about the Dalits was inspiring, I was impressed by the people who have suffered for so long, making a change for the better, but I have to ask why the need for that final paragraph about the man who doesn’t get to come to America to work. Maybe it’s his karma to change his own country rather than take jobs from citizens or residents here. As a matter of fact why aren’t all these people staying in their own country and making a difference. A little background:
I am a Caucasian American male who suffers from reverse discrimination on an almost daily basis; reverse racism, reverse sexism and economic discrimination. I was born here during a progressive period of United States history when people who had suffered these biases began to see improvements in their lives as a result of progressive changes in the political and social climates. I, however, have seen none of that in my own experience, because I am a white male, born to a divorced white economically disadvantaged mother. Welfare was given to the minority poor from tax increases on the blue collar class, not the rich; we saw none of that. My mother worked a day job as an underpaid accounting clerk then worked contract janitorial jobs at night just to pay for the essentials. My younger brother and I would work with her at night cleaning the toilets of rich corporate America; this after going to school all day, working our paper routes and mowing lawns. We never complained, sold drugs, and killed other kids in our neighborhood that lived in similar circumstances.
While economically disadvantaged minorities were given first shot at educational grants (some rightly so) even if they would never use them to their fruition or scored as high on their SATs as I did, I got nothing; I had to quit high school my junior year to take a job as a mail clerk to support my younger siblings and my mother; who became disabled as a result of a major car accident. Oh we finally qualified for Medi-Cal, but nothing else.
No one came to our door to offer our family free government cheese, housing or the like. Organizations designed to assist the economically disadvantaged minorities never called us to offer us any of those benefits even though I had spent many nights in bed hungry because the last of the food went to my little sister. But we persevered, maintained our integrity and I figured it would build good character to suffer like others had; at least that is what my church taught us. So I didn’t complain, whine, steal from my neighbors or sell drugs to get by. My mom didn’t sell herself on the streets to maintain a drug habit, despite not having money for medication to help deal with the pain she suffered as a result of her injuries.
When I went back to school, to college, in order to get a degree in Fine Arts there was no money for schooling from the government or grants for white men, they were all directed to minorities. When I changed my major to Computer Science, there were no financial incentives to assist me, I had to work for it; two jobs at a time. Even during my first marriage, I worked two jobs, went to school when I could afford it and let my wife stay home to tend to the children. There was no socialized education like in foreign countries to put me through a Master’s Program, even though I was getting ‘A’s in my computer courses.
And despite continued economic disadvantages through my 28th year (during Reagan trickle down freakonomics) I worked toward the American dream, took care of my family and attempted to continue my education so that they could benefit from my efforts. But when I went to get a job as a computer programmer I was passed over for the minority or woman applying for the same job, even if I scored higher on the test or carried a higher GPA.
Not once during this period did I ever protest, not once did I call my representative to ask them to enact laws that would give me a free education, not once did I go to my church and ask people to march down the street in protest over my living conditions. And not once did I cross over the border of another country to seek a job as a below subsistence wage earner, I stayed in my own country and made the best of it.
Even when I lost my family to divorce and my children to a gender-biased judiciary, I just plodded on, rebuilt my life as best as I could and go as much of an education as I could afford in order to become the skilled technologist I am today.
But now I have to live with guest workers being imported to this country to take the job I was trained for because corporations are trying to artificially deflate the prevailing wage of citizen PhDs, Masters and Bachelors Engineers and they have been given carte blanche by our government. Now I have no job despite taking classes to keep up my skill set, it was given to H-1B visa guest workers or it was outsourced to India, Russia and China. I am 50 and I am sure despite almost 25 years experience, I can not get a job because of ageism in the corporate world and I am reduced to asking for piece work to make enough money to eat. The home it took me 42 years to buy is in foreclosure, my mother may lose hers because I have no money to pay her property tax, which I was doing because she can’t get a descent paying job at 69 years of age.
If I was a foreign national from a country where schooling is free through college, I could get a job here faster than I could as a citizen. But instead I am spending my evenings trying to figure out what to do after the unemployment runs out; maybe I will go back to cleaning the toilets of rich, bailed out, Corporate America and their imported foreign workers, wait I can’t, because the illegal immigrants are doing that.
From Hatfield, PA, 04/15/2009
Good job Marketplace! The caste-hindus should be very cowardice and they would never ever be humans. They are just castes not human beings! They are born with caste, they live with caste and they die with caste. That's it! They will never share anything with Dalits except their sadist violences. They are the killers of Dalits. They donot want Mayawati to become India's Prime MInister so that the casste hindus in USA are much worried lest an Untouchable women will become the PM of the country. Lina one day you go to India; I'll get a both ticket for you and I'll also pay for you; you just go and work as a scavenger and carry your people's shit on your head and shoulder. Then you'll understand whether your reaction to Marketplace is sensible. You caste hindus are now under threat lest your caste monster has been out in the atreets of USA. Isn't it? Shameless caste hindus! Maitreyi
Hatfield PA USA
From upper darby, PA, 04/15/2009
If we say human being is the most rational being then I will say the Indian castiest mindset is the most irrational in the world and the statements of Betigeri and Patel reflects that caste mindset. No matter where they go in the world the psyche will remain same. The same people who questions the justified affirmative action policy will never question why A crime is committed against a Dalit every 18 minutes why 27 atrocities committed against Dalits every day, why 13 Dalits are murdered every week, why
6 Dalits are kidnapped or abducted every week , why 3 Dalit women are raped every day, (Official Crime Statistics in India from 2001- 2005) Why they burn dalit houses, why the Dalits are denied the basic rights of education, economic, social, political ,religious and cultural life? And why dalits are denied the life of dignity ? why their representation is very less in government jobs, in media in politics, in the position of power and money ? why they could not make a meal a day ? The only answer is age old/ thousand years of caste discrimination and systemic exploitation of Dalit which is religiously justified. Upper caste constitute the less percentage of the Indian population but still because of their caste status they grab the 90% of the positions of power and money, In politics, in high class-high paid government jobs and private sector jobs, industries, media, everywhere they hold the position. From thousand years these so called upper caste have been exploiting the lower on the basis of caste, and still want to enjoy those privileges by making irrational-unjust theory.
1. Before opposing the affirmative action policy look back/question first the daily atrocities being done on the Dalits
2. Just look back to why the representation of so called upper caste is higher in everywhere where as their percentage in population is very low, if we reverse the reservation policy and limit the upper caste to their population share then these so called upper caste will be nowhere
3. India is not the only country where affirmative action policy is existed there are number of countries which implement these policies and they have in both sector i.e. in government sector as well as in private sector. In India we don’t have affirmative action policy in private sector, we should learn from USA –Malaysia and should implement affirmative policy in private sector too and should give the original inhabitant of the land their rights, and taking into consideration present economic policies and its impact any rational government and individual should give that the first priority
4. Indian private sector talk about merit, quality and no reservation and when the issue of multinational companies comes the Indian companies talk about giving priority/incentives/subsidy to DESI Indian companies then where is merit and quality.
5. Leena patel said there is discrimination in USA TOO , SO my question is do you want to justify the Indian caste based discrimination and exploitation? Have you studied and observed about how USA HAS TRIED TO ERADICATE RACIAL DISCRIMINATION BY IMPLEMENTING DIVERSITY/AFFIRMATIVE ACTION POLICY ON GOVERNMENT AND PRIVATE SECTOR.
6. The people like Patel and Betigeri will talk about Merit because they lost the Merit to talk about any other thing.
Affirmative action policy is the most justified policy given by Dr.B. R. Ambedkar to bring the marginalized to the mainstream after studying the affirmative action policies of other countries like USA. It has been helping the marginalized to come up in a life with bright colors and without affirmative policy it was impossible. Still there are few who got benefited and large number of people still on the same situation because most of the policy makers and implementation authority are from upper strata of the society. There is need to increase the representation of Dalit community in various spheres of life and only affirmative action policy is the best reply for that.
From Hatfield, PA, 04/15/2009
hi everyone,
This is not just a story but it is a reality. One cannot just ignore it. If you do so then you have selective vision.
It is sad to read that people are not ready to accept the fact that Indian Dalits still face the social segregation.
Yes it is hard to accept the truth that our country still follows untouchability.
The statistics says "everyday 3 dalit women are raped" many are unreported.
one can go through the following articles...(it is not a decade old) to understand the plight of the dalits in India. it is just a few samples from a book of discrimination...
http://www.countercurrents.org/dalit-mountain200306.htm
http://www.dalitnetwork.org/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caste-related_violence_in_India
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2009/03/04/landless-casteless-educated-rohidas-butchered-in-gandhis-animie-ramrajya-the-panchayat-raj-castevirus-004mh2009/
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2009/02/14/rape-its-a-caste-order/
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2008/12/05/blind-by-birth-casted-out-by-authorities-castevirus011mh08/
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2008/10/20/ban-manual-scavenging-tells-law-commission/
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2008/10/17/chennai-high-court-says-no-to-manual-scavenging/
http://atrocitynews.wordpress.com/2007/02/26/a-girl-raped-in-bihar-writes-to-kalam-caste-virus-05bh2007/
Sudarshan Betigeri
From Philadelphia, PA, 04/15/2009
Thank you very much Marketplace for throwing flood of light on the sufferings of Dalits in caste-ridden India. I wonder about how dare these caste-hindus are reacting and spiting venom on Dalits who are still considered as sub-humans in any part of India. Sudarshan Betigeri from Minneapolis has commented “Currently the "reservations" which the report talks about has 52% reservation for the Dalits and 48% for the rest of India. Where is the justice here?” Sudarshan has no any knowledge about Indian social structure except his caste arrogance. Mr.Sudarshan let me tell you about social structure in caste-ridden India.
According to Census of India 2001 (the latest), the Dalit population (Scheduled Castes) is not 52% and it is 16% and Tribal population is 7.5%. If you include Dalit Christians and Buddhist converts it adds just around 3%. Thus the total Dalit and Tribal population may not exceed 26.5%. Rests of 73.5% are the non-Dalit people. The reservation in education and employment is not just a political adjustment due to electoral politics. Reservation is the fundamental rights of the Dalits and Tribal people in India. When M.K.Gandhi, the leader of hindus did not agree with the separate electorates to Dalits sanctioned by the British and threatened very cunningly by a drama of fast-unto-death, Dr. Ambedkar, the Father of Constitution of India and the leader of Oppressed of India bravely confronted Gandhi and his followers (caste-hindus) and made a constitutional arrangement for reservation through Poona Pact in 1932. Mr Sudarshan should know the statistics what percentage of beneficiaries through reservation have got job in government sectors. Since its inception in pre-independent times, the jobs through reservation availed to Dalits and Tribals have been just less than 2% of the total jobs availed to all sections of caste India. Even the Annual and Five Year Plan budgets are useless as the caste-people discriminate Dalits and Tribals by allotting some meager amount which is just below than 1.6% of the total budget amount. This amount is also either often diverted or kept unspent or sent back to the exchequer. But they speak of some empty phrases like financial inclusion and inclusive growth. Then what about the jobs so far given to people? Who are the big beneficiaries? Certainly the non-Dalits who consist ¾ of the total population. Billions of money are eaten by caste hindus only.
My question to Sudarshan, Shubhanan and Lina Patel and other caste-ridden hindus (even in America) is: Are any one of you called as Untouchable in India? Are any one of you unallowed in your worshiping and other public places? Have you ever been unallowed to wear chapels? Have your sisters or mothers ever been raped in front of your kith and kin? Have you ever been asked by your class teacher to clean his toilets? Have your sister or brother or any of your so-called brahman, kshatriya or sudra carried human excreta on their head? The caste and untouchability questions in India are cruel. Lina, you should go to India this time and stay with any of Dalit family in rural or urban area. I know you will be polluted. How inhuman you caste hindus are! Just for less than half-an-hour program, the caste hindu Diaspora is spiting venom on the Oppressed and reacting to the Marketplace. If the program continues for couple of time, I think you caste hindus, will you get kill yourself? For your information, India is not just one nation and it is always a two nations of nation – one is caste-India and another is Dalit India, because every village in India (more than 7,00,000 villages + 7,00,000 Dalit colonies = India) has a colony.
Mr.Sudarshan and others, I tell you guys, it is atrocious that you have reacted in a very cheap way. If you are ready to arrange any debate on Dalit issue and your caste issue, I am ready to arrange or tell me whether you do arrange.
I appreciate Marketplace for you have done a remarkable broadcasting to highlight to an extent the issues of Dalits in caste-ridden India. I also appreciate Mr.Chandraban Prasad for his inputs. Particularly I have to appreciate Mr. Michael Thevar, Vice President of Temp Solutions, Inc for his bold interview and for his efforts to bringing Dalit and Tribal Clinicians, Psychotherapists and Behavioral Specialists to United States and staffing them in dignified and respectable positions through his company. Sudarshan and other hindus in America should know that the so-called ‘merit’ is nothing but a centuries-long politics that you caste people have been doing.
The leader and redeemer of Dalits voices, “Our struggle is not a fight for wealth or for power; ours is a struggle for the reclamation of human personality”.
Sakya Mohan
Philadelphia
From PA, 04/15/2009
i strongly believe our country (India) has two faces,,the real India is unknown to rest of the world..it was conscious efforts to glorify India as "the best civilized and well cultured society" by people migrated in past.. that is why now its getting hard to accept the reality..i would suggest them to visit real rural india speicially MP, UP, Bhihar, CG, JH, Orissa, Rajastan, even Kolkata all these states having more than 56%of india's population..if it is not convincing then why we need poverty alleviation program targeting to Dalits and ST in more than 600 Districts india. Why India and Indian NGO ask billions of Dollers on the name of SC.ST from foreign funding and where this money goes?????? People has been talking about reservation policy..let me re correct them its not the word "reservation" used in Constitution,,the actual word is REPRESENTATION of marginalized population in mainstreaming. Unfortunately the people who were responsible to implement constitution were had brahminical mindset, that is why the targets were never been achieved..you must see the backlog of Recruiting SC.STs.in government institution across the level in all states. the story above is just one example..i like my country, but it doesn't mean i shall ignore everything,,, this is the country when one Raj( child) falling into empty tub well whole media, was broadcasting news for three days..but when whole dalit family(5member) brutally killed, and females were gandraped, same media administration, government were simply sleeping and egnored the incident... still we would like to say mera bharat mahan ???????????? personally i will appreciate this effort of introducing real face of Internal INDIA..
From Minneapolis, MN, 04/15/2009
Although this story about India's Dalits would be a politically correct type of reporting, it is a one sided depiction about the social dynamics of India. The report mentioned 160 million Dalits living in India. But it didn't bother to report how many of these are really living below the poverty line and how many need uplifting. Are all of these 160 million Dalits study under lights and are discriminated against in society? No! There are equal or more number of so called "upper class" who live in the same economic conditions as the Dalits. But nobody in the government cares about changing their standard of living.
About reservations, less said the better. Currently the "reservations" which the report talks about has 52% reservation for the Dalits and 48% for the rest of India. Where is the justice here? The original reservation system in the constitution was created to last 15 years from 1950 (the year the constitution was written of independent India). The intent was to change the living standards of one generation of Dalits, so that their future generations could compete well in the entire society. But of course politicians needed votes, so this original expiry date of reservation system in the constitution has been kept on amended indefinitely. There is no doubt that the Dalits used to be oppressed, but that was half a century ago! It is time the country moved on, and treated all the sections of the society equally. The non-Dalits in the meanwhile are continually getting a raw deal. The reservation system is implemented right from the higher educational institutions and goes on to government jobs. The only place where merit based selection is left is the private sector. The government cannot and should not mandate reservations here. Reservation really defeats the merit based system, and soon people will just want reservation for their own community so they have to work less and enjoy disproportionate benefits.
The reservation system has to be amended to include only the economically backward section of the society, Dalits or Non-Dalits. This is the fairest form of equal opportunity. All in all, completely disappointed by Marketplace's one sided reporting.
From San Francisco, CA, 04/15/2009
Very good story, but it hardly does justice to the issue.
The problems of the untouchables are very real even as India moves into the space age. But, more than anything this is an issue of bad governance than anything else. The politicians use the dalits as vote banks and bleed the system in the process.
I have no issues with having monetary and other kinds assistance for the dalits. But by providing reservations in top universities, the system is producing a lot of unqualified people. For example, it requires only a second class (GPA 2) to get admitted to a medical degree program. However, for other people the qualifying grade would be a GPA of 3.5 or more. And on top of that, the real needy people do not get the reservations. It goes to some category that was created by the politicians to cater to a favorite group.
In the process we are getting a doctor who is not qualified but got the degree, thereby putting a big question mark on the education system and the quality of medical service that I as a user may receive.
This is reason the reservation system is vehemently opposed (and not for the reasons of caste) not only by people but also by the private sector companies, which are afraid they will lose their edge due to the quality of candidates they hire.
From Los Angeles, CA, 04/15/2009
I listened with interest to the reporting on Dalit's in India. It's funny that we in America forget we have our own form of "untouchable"-ism. If you sent the same resume with the name of a caucasian-sounding male and then a Latina name, or a Vietnamese name or even a woman's name, I bet you would find the same sort of discrimination. We elected Obama but there is still plenty of prejudice and outright racisim right here at home. Also the Dalit politician that was mentioned, Mayawati, yes she is a Dalit, but that fact should not ennoble her to a reporter. Do you know what she stands for? What her platform is? You may find it enlightening to find out.
Thank you,
Lina
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